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	<title>The Wandering Heretic</title>
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	<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com</link>
	<description>Neither Protestant nor Catholic, Reformed nor Evangelical, Conservative nor Liberal; But Some Strange Flute-Playing Mutation Between</description>
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		<title>R.I.P. Andrew M. Greeley</title>
		<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2013/05/31/r-i-p-andrew-m-greeley/</link>
		<comments>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2013/05/31/r-i-p-andrew-m-greeley/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 May 2013 18:46:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Caine</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Tributes]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wanderingheretic.com/?p=775</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I learned yesterday that Father Andrew M. Greeley died on Wednesday, May 29, 2013. Curiously a day shy of the 7th anniversary of my Father&#8217;s death. You can see the full article]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="padding: 10px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 18pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; float: left; font-family: times,serif; color: brown;"><img src="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/wp-images/icons/greeley.jpg" alt="Andrew M. Greeley" /></span>I learned yesterday that Father Andrew M. Greeley died on Wednesday, May 29, 2013.  Curiously a day shy of the 7th anniversary of my Father&#8217;s death.  </p>
<p>You can see the full article <a href=http://www.latimes.com/news/obituaries/la-me-andrew-greeley-20130531,0,1017591.story">here</a>.  He will be missed.  I understand that after the accident, his mind was pretty much on auto-pilot, but he enjoyed the company of his sister and her children during those later years. </p>
<p>God bless, Father Greeley.  Rest in Peace and may the Lord be as merciful to your soul as He needs to be for all of us.</p>
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		<title>New Life to the Context Group Version (and to me)!</title>
		<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2011/11/29/new-life-to-the-context-group-version-and-to-me/</link>
		<comments>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2011/11/29/new-life-to-the-context-group-version-and-to-me/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov 2011 04:42:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Caine</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Context Group Version]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wanderingheretic.com/?p=743</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Those who have read and used my Context Group Version translation of the Bible may have noticed I have not updated it recently. Indeed, I have not updated anything much on this website for over a year. Much of it has to do with events in my life that have taken up almost all of [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="font:18pt times,serif;float:left;color:brown;padding:10px;"><img src="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/wp-images/pdabible.jpg" alt="Palm Bible" /></span> Those who have read and used my Context Group Version translation of the Bible may have noticed I have not updated it recently.  Indeed, I have not updated anything much on this website for over a year.  Much of it has to do with events in my life that have taken up almost all of my available time, both professional and personal.  To start, My no-longer-very-new job that I started in December of 2008 still manages to take up a lot of learning time due to my no-longer-very young brain.  </p>
<p>In addition, last year I was diagnosed with prostate cancer, stage 2C3. That stage basically means it is about to, or at a small level already has spread outside the prostate.  So last year was taken up with tests, more tests, biopsies, and six months of daily radiation treatments. However, as John Piper, another fellow prostate cancer survivor always says, &#8220;Now I feel fine and the doctors are happy.&#8221;  Not much more to say.  As cancer survivors know, tomorrow can bring a change; but for today&#8230;</p>
<p><span id="more-743"></span></p>
<p>Then immediately after the treatments finished, death paid too many visits to my family in 2011. Though I escaped it&#8217;s clutches, on the very first day of the year it claimed the college-aged, basketball star son of my cousin.  Then my mother-in-law died in April and my Father-in-law at the very start of this November.  It seemed we would finish one funeral only to start planning the next, with little time for actual grief and mourning. </p>
<p>So my time has been pretty tied up for the last two years.  Not for the better. However, these were not only reasons I stopped worked on updating the CGV.  I hit a very large dead-end in the way I designed the CGV to be used.  One I thought was truly fatal to the translation.</p>
<p>You see, I tied the major usage of the CGV to the Palm Pilot Palmbible+ package.  Then Palm changed the OS of their cellphone/palm pilots to WebOS.  That made the Palmbible+ package obsolete.  In essence, <a href="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/02/12/just-got-my-palm-pre/">unless you used a rather expensive Palm emulator program</a> my Bible Version became just as obsolete.  Then even the Palm Pre&#8217;s WebOS became obsolete when it was bought out and then abandoned by HP.  I thought the CGV went down with the Palm Pilot ship.</p>
<p>I started to work on porting it over to the Kindle, but the effort frankly was not where my interests lied, and it would have taken over a year&#8217;s solid work with no change in the actual text itself.  That prospect just didn&#8217;t excite me.  Maybe it is selfishness or lack of faith, or whatever, but cancer does teach you one thing: your time is limited.  I decided I wanted to spend whatever time I have left (and it may be decades) with my wife instead of in front of a computer screen.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/04/08/the-immeasurable-loss-of-michael-spencer/">The death of Michael Spencer</a> may have also contributed to my change in priorities as well.  Methinks had Spencer known he would die in his 50&#8242;s, he would have spent less time blogging as well.</p>
<p>But&#8230;.</p>
<p>There always is a but&#8230; but this time it is for the better!</p>
<p>In the last few days, I have received correspondence from Brad Cobb of the <a href="http://www.mcloudchurchofchrist.com">McLoud Church of Christ</a>. He desired to make the CGV available in e-sword format.  With the documents I was able to provide, he succeeded. So for those that use the PC Program e-sword, you can now download and use the Context Group Version <a href="http://www.biblesupport.com/e-sword-downloads/file/6918-context-group-version-2010-complete-bible/">here</a>.  According to Cobb, 27 users downloaded the version in the first couple of hours it was available.  That is somehow very gratifying to me.  (That may be more than ever downloaded it for the Palm in the years it was available on that platform!)  The E-Sword program itself, if you don&#8217;t have it already can be downloaded from <a href="http://www.e-sword.net/">here</a>.</p>
<p>However, I am a Mac user and iPhone user.   E-Sword is not easily available on either OSX or iOS.  However, all is not lost there either.  For Mac and iPhone users, my Palm program had the here-to-fore unused option of creating &#8220;Sword&#8221; project files.  (E-Sword and Sword are two entirely different programs&#8211;confusing, I know.)  Anyway, I am going to make the Sword versions available for download <a href="ftp://ftp.wanderingheretic.com/public_ftp/outgoing/CGV.zip">here</a>.  <strong>Warning</strong>: click on the link and the download will immediately start.</p>
<p>The Sword Program for the PC can be downloaded <a href="http://www.crosswire.org/sword/software/index.jsp">here</a>.  The Mac Version (which right now is called &#8220;Eloquent&#8221; (Heaven knows why) can be downloaded from <a href="http://www.macsword.com/download/">here</a>.</p>
<p>What is more awesome to me is that the Sword Project has an iPad and iPhone version that can be obtained using the iTunes connection from <a href="http://itunes.apple.com/app/Pocketsword/id341046078">here</a>.  Imagine, the CGV can now be put on your iPhone or iPad for free!  </p>
<p>Once you download the Sword module, and load the iPhone app, the instructions to put them together are <a href="http://crosswire.org/pocketsword/PocketSword/PocketSword/Entries/2009/12/24_Feature_Spot__Manually_Installing_Modules.html">here</a>.  I tried them, and they work great.  CGV is now on my iPhone 4S.   I am again energized&#8230;</p>
<p>&#8230;I&#8217;m thinking of some mods for the next installment.  James B. Jordan insists that the word we translate as &#8220;keep&#8221; in the Old Testament (as in &#8220;tend and keep the garden,&#8221; &#8220;My brother&#8217;s keeper&#8221;, etc.) is best translated as &#8220;guard&#8221; or &#8220;guardian.&#8221;  Checking with my Hebrew sources, he may be on to something.  I&#8217;ve done some preliminary work, and the substitution often makes better sense in the passages than not&#8230;. and &#8220;slime&#8221; being used for mortar in the Tower of Babel?  What was I thinking???</p>
<p>Yep, this could be the start of a great friendship&#8230;</p>
<p>Thanks, Brad.  I hear the flickering screen calling to me again.</p>
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		<title>Andrew Greeley Update</title>
		<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/09/08/andrew-greeley-update/</link>
		<comments>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/09/08/andrew-greeley-update/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Sep 2010 21:48:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Caine</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Culture]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Other]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Tributes]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wanderingheretic.com/?p=733</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I made a tribute post to the author/priest/sociologist Andrew M. Greeley almost two years ago now after his accident. Greeley was a huge influence in my life and remains so through his books and articles. Well, for some time after that, people wrote comments asking for updates on Fr. Greeley&#8217;s condition. I have had no [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="padding: 10px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 18pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; float: left; font-family: times,serif; color: brown;"><img src="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/wp-images/icons/greeley.jpg" alt="Andrew M. Greeley" /></span>I made a <a href="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2008/11/14/andrew-m-greeley-a-short-tribute/">tribute post</a> to the author/priest/sociologist Andrew M. Greeley almost two years ago now after his accident.  Greeley was a huge influence in my life and remains so through his books and articles. </p>
<p>Well, for some time after that, people wrote comments asking for updates on Fr. Greeley&#8217;s condition.  I have had no personal contact with Fr. Greeley for almost 10 years, but I do keep dibs on the internet traffic.  So I guessed his condition was not good, and that his Christmas novel issued last year was going to be his last.  But it was a guess.</p>
<p>I am very mortified to find out that I was probably correct.   Phil Potempa, a gentleman who writes <a href="http://www.nwitimes.com/entertainment/columnists/offbeat/article_371bc70f-5d7e-5c8c-927d-ba21ca2f8c21.html">an Entertainment column</a> has been in contact with Fr. Greeley&#8217;s assistant. I reproduce his article on that conversation here:<br />
<span id="more-733"></span></p>
<blockquote><p>There has been very little news to share about this unfortunate accident. But I&#8217;m happy to provide as much updated information as possible. Greeley&#8217;s website at agreeley.com hasn&#8217;t been updated since the early spring. However, his personal assistant Roberta Wilk was kind enough to share the latest, which I&#8217;ve included here.</p>
<p>&#8220;Dear Philip,</p>
<p>Thank you for your nice note and well wishes for Fr. Greeley. I will forward your e-mail to his family, and make sure Fr. Greeley sees it, too. We go over his mail together about twice a week. And, I assure you he will enjoy reading yours. I apologize for taking so long to get back to you. There has really been little change in Fr. Greeley&#8217;s health status. He has physical therapy twice a week, and seems to be progressing on that count. But the traumatic brain injury he sustained back in November of 2008 was very, very severe, and I sadly report there&#8217;s been no change here.</p>
<p>- &#8211; Roberta Wilk, assistant&#8221;</p>
<p>This is all I have to share.</p>
<p>While on the mend in Chicago, he is also being cared for by his nieces and nephews.</p>
<p>Wilk is the priest&#8217;s assistant at the National Opinion Research Center at the University of Chicago. Greeley is a research associate at the National Opinion Research Center and is also professor of sociology at the University of Arizona, where he had been teaching one semester a year.</p>
<p>For readers unfamiliar with 82-year-old Greeley&#8217;s Nov. 7, 2008 accident, the bestselling novelist was exiting a taxi at the Rosemont CTA Blue Line train station to return to his home downtown after speaking at an academic conference.</p>
<p>His jacket got stuck on the door as the taxi driver pulled away, according to the Rosemont police spokesman. Greeley fractured his skull and left orbital bone near his eye, according to his friend and attorney Terry Goggin and he was in critical condition when he arrived at Advocate Lutheran General Hospital in Park Ridge, where doctors used CT scans and installed a device in his skull to monitor pressure on his brain, since he had suffered head injuries from the fall.</p>
<p>After a two-month hospital stay, including time at the Rehabilitation Institute of Chicago (RIC), he returned home to continue what his family describes as &#8220;intensive therapy for traumatic brain injury.&#8221;</p>
<p>Greeley, born and raised in Oak Park, Ill., has written more than 120 books and is famous for his outspoken views. His willingness to frequently appear on the talk shows of Phil Donahue and Oprah Winfrey discussing what his fellow priests deemed &#8220;sensitive subjects&#8221; has at times agitated church officials.</p>
<p>In 1986, the Archdiocese of Chicago refused a $1 million donation by Greeley from his book sales.</p>
<p>However, in 2003, they did accept a similar donation for nearly half a million.</p>
<p>His last book, just sent off prior to his accident, is a 192-page hardcover titled &#8220;Home for Christmas&#8221; (Forge Books $14.99) a novel about a soldier named Peter, on his third deployment in Iraq, who becomes injured and finds himself both alive and dead on a wondrous spiritual journey where he is given a second chance at life from God Himself.&#8221;
</p></blockquote>
<p>So Greeley&#8217;s mental condition remains unimproved in almost two years time.  I grieve a world that allows such brilliance to be lost to us.  Please continue to pray for this amazing priest and human being.  </p>
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		<slash:comments>14</slash:comments>
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		<item>
		<title>So You Think You Want a Blogsite&#8230;</title>
		<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/07/14/so-you-think-you-want-a-blogsite/</link>
		<comments>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/07/14/so-you-think-you-want-a-blogsite/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jul 2010 01:08:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Caine</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Culture]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Other]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Rants]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wanderingheretic.com/?p=714</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I used to have a porn problem. No, not the kind of problem you are thinking of right now. Instead, I had a porn spam problem. Hundreds, indeed thousands, of comments with links to pornography sites were attaching themselves to this blogsite. Nor was I alone in this attack. Apparently Real Live Preacher had much [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="padding: 10px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 18pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; float: left; font-family: times,serif; color: brown;"><img src="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/wp-images/virus.jpg" alt="Computer porn spam" /></span>I used to have a porn problem.  No, not the kind of problem you are thinking of right now.  Instead, I had a porn <em>spam</em> problem.  Hundreds, indeed thousands, of comments with links to pornography sites were attaching themselves to this blogsite.</p>
<p>Nor was I alone in this attack.  Apparently <a href="http://www.reallivepreacher.com/">Real Live Preacher </a>had much the same problem.  His site was so infiltrated with comments generated by porn sites that he just about permanently shut down his archives.  You see, the porn spammers don&#8217;t attack recent posts.  They go for the older posts that you are less likely to notice and maintain.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know exactly how it works, but such sites have programmatic worms that travel through the internet.  These &#8220;worms&#8221; then find websites (using a means I cannot say—perhaps a stray comment or word on your site attracts them) and then create comments on blog posts.  These comments contain links back to their sites.<br />
<span id="more-714"></span><br />
The purpose?  I asked that very question to my previous host provider.  He told me the purpose is to increase their websites&#8217; priority and visibility on Google and Yahoo searches in the internet.  Those search engines have their own variety of &#8220;worms&#8221; that search the internet and make indexes and references within the Google programs.   That is how when you search for keywords such as &#8220;preterist&#8221; or &#8220;heretic,&#8221; a recent column from my blog-post may appear, perhaps just hours after I write it.   I don&#8217;t submit this article to Google or Yahoo.  Instead, their programs find my site and update their records on their own.</p>
<p>Well, the more references to your own website on other websites, the higher your website will appear on the Google or Yahoo (or Bing, to remain current) becomes.  Therefore, the porn sites prey on unprotected websites, attaching their comments with their nefarious links back to their own sites. These links on other site have the effect of increasing their profile—albeit, illegitimately—on the web. This increased profile brings up their sites faster on the web for those people search for such things.  And they have the added bonus of linking in unaware people from other sites, who once they get there may linger.</p>
<p>I once wrote a post entitled &#8220;<a href="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2005/10/13/the-porn-culture-and-teens/">The Porn Culture Takes Over</a>.&#8221;  I have a feeling that title drew in those programmatic links like sharks sensing blood in the water.   I don&#8217;t regret the article, but I do regret the results.  </p>
<p>So I set out to clear out the problem as best I could.  Unlike Real Live Preacher, I did not want to shut down my archives.  Nor did I want anyone clicking on a link on my site and ending up at a porn advertisement or worse.  First, I loaded a Spam filter (actually two) on my site that would do its best to at least slow down the infiltration of degenerated comments to a trickle.  Then I set out on the ugly task of taking out the old comments one by one.</p>
<p>At first it was easy.  The porn comments were computer generated and were basically filled with descriptions of lewd acts. I could sent them into the spam filters with an easy click of the mouse.  Then as I got to the more recent &#8220;additions&#8221; it became harder.  The comments were more generic and did not reference anything related to sexual acts. They were statements more like &#8220;Thanks for this post. I really helped me to rethink this issue.&#8221;  Even later comments even somehow integrated words from my original post within them.  The only way I could really be certain that the comment was false was when I examined the link within the comment it was to something like sexywomenforviewing (dot) com or something obviously tied to a more lustful reality. So to those comments as well I consigned to Spam Hades.</p>
<p>Then the links became less obvious.  (Were these guys tracking what I was doing?  It almost felt like that, though probably they were fighting millions of bloggers doing the same housekeeping chores.)  Now the links went to perhaps older sites that were bought out by the porn dogs.  When you linked to those sites, they automatically forwarded you to the nefarious movies and pictures, some instantly running when you got there!  These had such innocent links like &#8220;wtbsradio (dot) com&#8221; or even more innocuous sites.  As I said, pornographers buy out legitimate sites that lose their domain name either through death of the owner or negligence or loss of interest.  They then put in imbedded links on these former legitimate sites to theirs.  Even Disney and the White House have been victimized by this tactic.</p>
<p>And in this case, the <em>only way to know is to test out the link by clicking on it</em>.  Now that was a really ugly business. Then I found BlueCoat&#8217;s K9 Web Protection and that helped me for awhile.   It would block the website after I clicked on the link and not let it show.  Then it let me know I almost went to a porn site.  Unfortunately, after that, my company upgraded their  Citrix programs and they conflicted with K9 so I had to uninstall it.  Luckily by then, by web-cleaning (literally) was almost finished.</p>
<p>Now I think between my Spam Filters and my increasing ability to spot a sham comment that gets through, I have my website back down to a maximum PG rating.  For those who in the past clicked on comments and went where they did not desire to go, my sincere apologies.  I am doing my best to ensure it does not happen again.  I such a link does occur for you, please report it to me immediately and I will get rid of it.  </p>
<p>This goes even for links within my posts themselves.  Those too may have once pointed to legitimate sites where the domain names were later taken over by the pornographers.  I have tries to check out all those as well, but such changes are almost impossible to catch without, again, click on each link on  a regular basis.  Not something I have the time to do.  And spam filters don&#8217;t catch <em>those</em> references.  So again, if you click on a past post and go to such a site, report it to me immediately. </p>
<p>However, now that I have pretty much stopped the flow of porn comment spam, I have attracted a new foe.  This one is even more insidious and insistent than my former enemy.   And  my spam filters are also being challenged (and failing miserably) to catch these messages.</p>
<p>Now instead of porn spam I am getting regular attacks of false comments linked back to <strong>Payday Lender sites</strong>!  Part of it is my fault I guess.  A few years back, I wrote in defense of these businesses—contrary to many of my friends and even my pastor and church.   I still would insist that the regulations enforced on these institutions are unfair and perhaps even economically dangerous.</p>
<p>That is, until they targeted this site for their comment spam.  Now I wish we had put them <em>all</em> out of business.  That I guess, is the reward I earned for supporting free enterprise.</p>
<p>I guess I would prefer to have the payday lender spam over the porn comments.  But barely ..just barely.</p>
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		<title>Preterists and the Millennium (Part 2)</title>
		<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/07/13/preterists-and-the-millennium-part-2/</link>
		<comments>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/07/13/preterists-and-the-millennium-part-2/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jul 2010 00:14:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Caine</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Biblical Studies]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Eschatology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Rants]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wanderingheretic.com/?p=706</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Warning: Don’t use this series of posts on the Millennium and Preterism as ammunition against the Preterist (or &#8220;Full Preterist&#8221;) eschatology. As I noted previously, Rev. 20:1-10 presents problems in almost every theology. We even define the main eschatological theories by these chapters (Pre-Millennial, A-Millennial, and Post-Millennial). Only Preterism does not have &#8220;Millennial&#8221; in its [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="padding: 10px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 18pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; float: left; font-family: times,serif; color: brown;"><img src="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/wp-images/The_Invasion_Of_Planet_Earth.jpg" alt="COG poster" /></span><strong>Warning:</strong> Don’t use this series of posts on the Millennium and Preterism as ammunition against the Preterist (or &#8220;Full Preterist&#8221;) eschatology. As I noted previously, <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 20:1-10" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2020.1-10/">Rev. 20:1-10</a> presents problems in almost every theology.  We even define the main eschatological theories by these chapters (Pre-Millennial, A-Millennial, and Post-Millennial).  Only Preterism does not have &#8220;Millennial&#8221; in its name!  No, I write this series not to demean Preterism by any means, but ultimately to strengthen it.</p>
<p>In fact, I regard this series of posts as taking on the best.  The only major chink in the Preterist&#8217;s armor is, in my opinion, their exegesis of these few verses.  As I noted previously, they &#8220;discount&#8221;  the millennium of these verses into a less than 40 year span of time between AD 30 and 67.  In short (pun intended), they are mistaken as to the duration of the Millennium.  In this post I hope to prove they are also mistaken as to the timing the Millennium as well.</p>
<p><span id="more-706"></span><br />
Because Preterism (at least in is most current incarnation) places the Millennium prior to AD 70 and the destruction of Jerusalem, they must accordingly put the events of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> <em>before</em> the events of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 18" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2018/">Revelation 18</a> and 19, which they say describe the destruction of that same city.  Accordingly, in this view, Revelation Chapter 20 has to be a recapitulation rather than a continuation of the events in the previous chapters.  Indeed, Preterist <a href="http://www.preteristarchive.com/Hyper/2002_vanwyngaarden_premillennial-preterism.html">Tracy D. VanWyngaarden</a> states baldly in one sentence all the assertions about Preterism and the Millenium that I have made thus far:</p>
<blockquote><p>[O]ne cannot escape the conclusion that “the thousand years” began in connection with the one and only “binding” of Satan, which occurred in connection with Christ’s first advent. Since Jesus clearly bound Satan prior to A.D. 70 (Matt. 12:31; <a class="bibleref" title="Heb. 2:14" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Heb.%202.14/">Heb. 2:14</a>), and John relates the beginning of the “thousand years” at that time, (<a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 20:2" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2020.2/">Rev. 20:2</a>). <strong>it only follows that Johns millennium episode is a recapitulation</strong>. John was looking back to the “things which you have seen” (or, past things). The “thousand year” binding of Satan was therefore among the “things which are” <strong>(the “thousand years“ being virtually identical with the Last Days)</strong>..(Emphasis added)</p></blockquote>
<p>Though I am not going to go into <a href="http://www.preteristcentral.com/Why%20the%20Single%20Millennium%20Model%20Forces%20a%20Futurist%20Eschatology.html">Kurt M. Simmons Two Millennial model</a>, in developing that model, he also promotes the &#8220;recapitulation model&#8221; of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>In other words, the images of <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 20:1-10" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2020.1-10/">Rev. 20:1-10</a> are not progressive, <strong>but a recapitulation</strong>. There were not three end-time battles, but one; the battle of Gog and Magog is the <em>same</em> battle described elsewhere in Revelation under different symbols.</p></blockquote>
<p>Sam Frost, one of the best exegetical Preterists, also posits that <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> recapitulates rather than progresses past the previous chapters. In his short <a href="http://thereignofchrist.com/essay-on-the-millennium-of-revelation-20/">Essay on the Millennium of Revelation 20</a>, he concludes:</p>
<blockquote><p>I have taken the position from William Hendriksen that <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 19:11" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2019.11/">Revelation 19:11</a>-ff occurs at the end of the Millennium, <strong>and is parallel with <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20:7" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020.7/">Revelation 20:7</a>-ff </strong> concerning Gog and Magog. The episode of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20:1-7" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020.1-7/">Revelation 20:1-7</a> does not come after the events of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 19:11" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2019.11/">Revelation 19:11</a>-ff. Further, I have taken from other commentators (Gentry and David Chilton included) that <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 19" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2019/">Revelation 19</a> <em>was fulfilled in the apocalyptic events of 70 AD. Therefore, the end of Millennial scheme refers to the Great Tribulation period of 66-70 AD. This places the “1000 years” between the advent of Christ’s birth, ministry, death, burial, resurrection, ascension, session, and finally, his fullness in the Parousia (that “God is all in all”). (bold text added for emphasis, italics in original)</em></p></blockquote>
<p>Therefore, for the premier Preterists, the 1000 year Millennium, even as a symbol, is reduced to 36-37 years. It is also assumed to have been initiated at Christ&#8217;s first advent and to have ended before the invasion of Jerusalem, even though the destruction is assumed by these same Preterists to be the subject of Chapter 19 and prior.  Although Frost makes a pretty good case in showing the parallels of the events (readers are strongly recommended to check out his essay), he does not make the case that <em>internally</em> there is an indicator within the test that this recapitulation is occurring.  Indeed, with a general reading it is difficult to read Chapter 20 as anything but a sequential progression from Chapter 19.</p>
<p>Other Preterists do see this discrepancy. For example, in the <a href="http://www.preterist.org/articles-old/q&#038;a.htm">Questions and Comments section at Preterist.org</a>, the following answer is found regarding the question: &#8220;Is there no millennium? Never was, never will be?&#8221;  This answer was written, I assume, by Ed Stevens—also no small name in the Preterist camp.</p>
<blockquote><p>I hope Max King’s suggestion (that the millennium was the period from 30 to 70 AD) is the correct one (it certainly sounds good). The term “thousand years” would then simply refer to the period of time while the kingdom was being built, before God came to judge His enemies. It was a time of completion. Jesus said in <a class="bibleref" title="Matthew 24" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Matthew%2024/">Matthew 24</a> that no man knew the day or the hour. All they could know was that it was getting close, by the signs He told them to watch for. But, I have a hard time totally accepting this theory of the millennium, since the millennium seems to fit in sequentially/chronologically after the events of <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 19" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2019/">Rev. 19</a> (which are manifestly 70 AD events). Some try to insert a “flash-back” or “recapitulation” early in <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2020/">Rev. 20</a> to get around this problem. But, I find that difficult to accept since <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 20:3, 4, 10" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2020.3%2C%204%2C%2010/">Rev. 20:3, 4, 10</a> mention events that supposedly happened before the millennium started, but which are the kinds of things that were happening during the period 30-70 AD when the millennium was supposedly in progress. If these events WERE 30-70 AD events and DID happen before the millennium started, then it would seem shaky to place the millennium in the period from 30-70 AD.</p></blockquote>
<p>Stevens notes that <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> indeed references many events that were mentioned in previous chapters of the book.  For instance, <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> mentions the mark of the beast, the souls of those beheaded because of the testimony of Jesus, and the beast and false prophet being in the lake of fire.  However, <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> <em>treats these events in the past tense</em> whereas the previous chapters regard them as occurring in the present tense. This indicates a sequential relationship rather than one of parallel or recapitulation as the majority Preterist position heralds.  </p>
<p>Also, Dr. Duncan McKenzie,  in a post at <a href="http://planetpreterist.com/news-5174.html">PlanetPreterist.com </a>, also makes the case for <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2020/">Rev. 20</a> being a continuation rather than a recapitulation of <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 19" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2019/">Rev. 19</a>.  He notes:</p>
<blockquote><p>One of the first matters to attend to in understanding the millennium is the question of how it fits in sequentially in relation to the rest of Revelation. Is the binding of Satan in <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20:1" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020.1/">Revelation 20:1</a> a continuation of the events of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 19" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2019/">Revelation 19</a> (the AD 70 fall of Babylon and the Second Coming) or is there a recapitulation (a going back and restating events that happened earlier)? Some say that there is a recapitulation here, that <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> is going back to the time of Pentecost (c. AD 30) or even the beginning of Jesus’ ministry (c. AD 26). My position is that <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> is a continuation of the (AD 70) events of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 19" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2019/">Revelation 19</a>, not a recapitulation to the time around AD 30….</p>
<p>Notice the sequence in Revelation19-20. The individual beast and false prophet (the one who made people take the mark of the beast <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 13:11-18" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2013.11-18/">Rev. 13:11-18</a>) are captured at the Second Coming in chapter 19 and put in the lake of fire. Satan is then taken and thrown in the abyss as the kingdom is established in chapter 20. Those who had lost their lives for not taking the mark of the beast (cf. <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 19:20; 13:15-16" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2019.20%3B%2013.15-16/">Rev. 19:20; 13:15-16</a>) are then resurrected in <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20:4" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020.4/">Revelation 20:4</a> at the beginning of the millennium. God was letting His first century audience know that the one who was faithful to Him to the point of death (cf. <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 2:10-11" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%202.10-11/">Rev. 2:10-11</a>) would still get to participate in the soon coming millennial reign (<a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 2:25-27; 3:21" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%202.25-27%3B%203.21/">Rev. 2:25-27; 3:21</a>).</p>
<p>Notice the reference to the mark of the beast as a past event in both chapter 19 and 20. <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> is a continuation of the AD 70 narrative of the Second Coming not a recapitulation to AD 30.</p></blockquote>
<p>So in summary, though some of the parallels are striking (Sam Frost almost convinces me), the best reading of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> appears to me—at least at the present time—to be describing the state of the world <em>after</em> the destruction of the Temple and the Old Covenant system and not before it.  However, this assertion then leaves open the nature of the Millennium and its relationship to the chapters after <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2020/">Rev. 20</a>.  </p>
<p>To that subject I will return in a subsequent post.  Stay tuned.  </p>
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		<title>Joshua&#8217;s People 6/23/10</title>
		<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/23/joshuas-people-62310/</link>
		<comments>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/23/joshuas-people-62310/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jun 2010 11:42:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Caine</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Joshua's People]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wanderingheretic.com/?p=702</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Two more to go, and then I will have my surprise. A 25 year old surprise. but a surprise none-the-less!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p align="center"><img src="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/wp-content/galleries/joshuas-people/20100623joshua.jpg" alt="Joshua's People cartoon for 6/4/10" /></p>
<p>Two more to go, and then I will have my surprise.  A 25 year old surprise. but a surprise none-the-less!</p>
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		<title>Preterists in the Millennial Arena</title>
		<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/10/preterists-in-the-millennial-arena/</link>
		<comments>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/10/preterists-in-the-millennial-arena/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jun 2010 02:20:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Caine</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Other]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Subversive Verse of the Month]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Tributes]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wanderingheretic.com/?p=683</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[My last post discussed problems with the current (and historic for that matter) expositions of Revelation Chapter 20. I noted how the fact that there remains nations in need of, and receiving, healing from the New Jerusalem in Revelation Chapter 21 places that city outside the confines of eternity (which by definition is past the [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="padding: 10px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 18pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; float: left; font-family: times,serif; color: brown;"><img src="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/wp-images/boxing-punch2.jpg" alt="knockout punch" /></span>My <a href="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/06/the-millennial-mess/">last post</a> discussed problems with the current (and historic for that matter) expositions of Revelation Chapter 20.  I noted how the fact that there remains nations in need of, and receiving, healing from the New Jerusalem in Revelation Chapter 21 places that city outside the confines of eternity (which by definition is <em>past</em> the point of healing).  So the various premillennial schemes, including the rather recent newcomer—Dispensationalism, fall by the wayside.  At best they could only posit that the Millennium would be only stage one in a two stage earthly existence where mortals remain on the earth.  I have heard no leader in that faction declare such a eschatological sequence.</p>
<p>Though in the varieties of theologies out there, perhaps someone has.  If readers are aware of such a proposed premillennial process please let me know and send me the references, links, or literary sources.</p>
<p>However, my concentration is going to be on what is, in my opinion, <strong>the strongest contender in the prophecetic boxing ring today: Full Preterism</strong>.  However, as I noted before, their interpretation of the Millennium is their soft underbelly that invites a one-two punch attack.   In their schema, the Millennial rule of Christ supposedly starts at the ascension and ends just prior to the Jewish Revolt of A.D. 67 or before.  As a result, their 1,000 year reign gets discounted to less than 37.  That calculates to a discount of over 96%.  You couldn&#8217;t get a deal like that on eBay!</p>
<p><span id="more-683"></span><br />
Nor am I the only one to notice this weakness.  Keith Mathison made this very point (perhaps his <em>only</em> good argument, in his contribution to the anti-Preterist diatribe, <em><strong><a href="http://www.amazon.com/When-Shall-These-Things-Hyper-Preterism/dp/0875525520/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&#038;s=books&#038;qid=1276123362&#038;sr=8-1">When Shall These Things Be: A Reformed Response to Hyper-Preterism</a></strong></em>:</p>
<blockquote><p>The most serious problem is that their [the Preterists'] &#8216;Millennium&#8217; is too short…Full preterists chide futurists for not taking seriously biblical language that denotes a short period of time…However, whether literal or figurative, &#8220;a thousand years&#8221; denotes a vast period of time. To suggest that &#8220;a thousand years&#8221; is symbolic of one generation of 40 years or less, I believe, stretches credulity to its breaking point. …I would suggest that &#8220;comprehensive preterists,&#8221; with their doctrine of the millennium, are not taking seriously enough Biblical language which clearly indicates a long period of time. I believe this is nothing but hermeneutical arbitrariness. We must take all time frame indicators seriously, those that point to short periods of time and those that point to long periods of time. (pg. 241)</p></blockquote>
<p>Though I hate to side with Mathison against the Preterists, the fact that the Preterists make the 1,000 year reign of Christ last less than 40, is a problem. Nor is Mathison alone finding this glaring weakness.  <a href= http://www.beyondtheendtimes.com/writing/book_reviews/critique_kc_review_balyeat.html">In his website</a>, Joseph R. Balyeat (author of <em><strong><a href=" http://www.amazon.com/Babylon-Revelation-Joseph-R-Balyeat/dp/0925591408/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&#038;s=books&#038;qid=1276219607&#038;sr=8-1">Babylon: the Great City of Revelation</a></strong></em>) also rather gleefully sends an uppercut to this same interpretive issue:</p>
<blockquote><p>[I]t seems to me that full preterism at times suffers from the same chronological blindness which preterists are so quick to criticize futurists for. I agree with you that it is quite ridiculous for futurists to claim that “soon” means 2,000 years and “the time is at hand” means 2 millennia. Yet, elsewhere in the book of Revelation (chapter 20), we read about events which were not to happen “soon”, but rather “at the end of 1,000 years”. These events include: the release of Satan for a short time to gather the remaining ungodly from the dark corners of the earth; the final judgment and second death of the wicked, etc. While I agree that the 1,000 years was not meant to be literal, it certainly does indicate a very long period of time. Yet the full preterist position argues that even these events were fulfilled in A.D. 70 or shortly thereafter (i.e., the Bar Kochba rebellion in A.D. 135). “Consistent” preterists become very in-consistent when they rail on futurists for saying “soon could mean 2,000 years”, while they themselves say “1,000 years could mean soon”. Are the time indicators relevant or aren’t they?</p></blockquote>
<p>So how do the Preterists defend themselves on this hermeneutical problem without falling on the ropes?  How do they support their contention that 1,000 years can be compressed into 37?  To their credit, at least they don&#8217;t ignore the issue hope it goes away. I quote from <a href="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/02/review-reading-the-bible-through-new-covenant-eyes-by-alan-bondar/">Alan Bondar</a>&#8216;s book, <strong><em><a href="http://www.amazon.com/Reading-Bible-Through-Covenant-Eyes/dp/1448984289/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&#038;s=books&#038;qid=1276124166&#038;sr=8-1">Reading the Bible Through New Covenant Eyes</a></em></strong>.  Building on Mathison&#8217;s admission that the number 1,000 is used symbolically, Bondar then notes..</p>
<blockquote><p>If &#8220;a thousand&#8221; is to be taken figuratively, then why must the work &#8220;years&#8221; be taken literally?  In other words, couldn&#8217;t it be just as well that John is not defining a literal period of time at all, whether it is actually one thousand exactly or a longer period of time?  John could just as well be figuratively describing the perfect accomplishments of Christ that no earthly king could possibly accomplish.  In fact, if &#8220;the figure…is the number of quantitative perfection,&#8221; then John is figuratively defining the prefect reign rather than a length of time….The thousand-year reign of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> is not about how long Christ would reign with His saints.  The thousand-year reign of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a> is about what would be perfectly accomplished during those forty years.</p></blockquote>
<p>Well, no.  If it is a symbol of <em>quantitative</em> perfection, as Bondar admits, then it must remain a <em>quantitative</em> symbol.  It should not then be changed to a <em>qualitative</em> symbol.  That is switching the category of the ultimate meaning of the symbol midstream.</p>
<p>At least the full preterist, Kenneth J. Davies, in his response to Mathison, maintains the 1,000 years of the Millennum as a <em>quantitative</em> symbol.  In his post, entitled rather inflammatorily, <a href="http://www.preterist.org/articles/mathisons_false_witness.asp"><em>A Response to the False Witness of Keith Mathison: as Found in His Presentation Named Playing With Fire</em></a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>The period from AD 30-70 is too short a time period to fit the symbol of &#8220;1,000 years&#8221; found in <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2020/">Rev. 20</a>, according to Mr. Mathison. It seems that to more than double the number of years this symbol represents is perfectly acceptable to Mathison, but not to &#8220;shorten&#8221; it!</p></blockquote>
<p>Well, yes.   Again, I have to agree with Mathison.  For those in the first century and not in our inflationary times, a &#8220;thousand&#8221; was a very large number.  Most people would not live to see a thousand of <em>anything</em> in their presence.  Barring the main city of Jerusalem, the other major cities barely would have 1,000 residents.   Even the title of the rather popular collection 1,001 Arabian Nights, published much later than the first century A.D. kept this association.  <a href="http://www.answers.com/topic/the-book-of-one-thousand-and-one-nights">According to one reviewer</a> &#8220;At first the title was merely indicative <strong>of a large number</strong> of stories; later editors dutifully provided editions with the requisite 1,001 tales.&#8221;</p>
<p>So does a 40 year, from A.D. 30 to A.D. 70  or the 37 year period from 30 to 67 meet the definition <strong>of a large number</strong> of years?  Does it seem reasonable to use a symbol of 1,000 years to represent this number?  It simply has to represent a larger number than a 37 or 40 year period.   A perfect number, certainly; at symbolic number, admittedly; but a larger number of years than 40, necessarily!</p>
<p>If the Preterists hold on to this interpretation, then time statements of any kind, their beloved &#8220;soon&#8221; passages, especially as they are referenced within this same &#8220;symbolic&#8221; book, also fall into the black hole of meaninglessness.   They will be knocked right out of the Prophetic Arena because of their Millennial glass jaws.  They will, like the line from <strong><em><a href=" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0047296/ ">On The Waterfront</a></em></strong>, be taken out of the Prophetic ring, only to declare to anyone who would bother to listen, &#8220;I coulda been a contender. I coulda been somebody, instead of a bum, which is what I am..&#8221;</p>
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		<title>The Millennial Mess</title>
		<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/06/the-millennial-mess/</link>
		<comments>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/06/the-millennial-mess/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jun 2010 22:36:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Caine</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Eschatology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Rants]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Theology]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[Last Lectures are the in thing right now. A book entitled The Last Lecture by Randy Pausch was a runaway hit on Amazon. At my old college, some brave professors participated in a program called “The Last Lecture Series.” In this series, they were to give a lecture to those attending as if it were [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="padding: 10px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 18pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; float: left; font-family: times,serif; color: brown;"><img src="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/wp-images/nakedbeforegod.jpg" alt="Naked Before God: The Return of the Lost Disciple" /></span>Last Lectures are the in thing right now.   A book entitled <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Last-Lecture-Randy-Pausch/dp/B002QOZ6LQ/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&#038;s=books&#038;qid=1275683921&#038;sr=8-2"><em><strong>The Last Lecture</strong></em></a> by Randy Pausch was a runaway hit on Amazon.  At my old college, some brave professors participated in a program called “The Last Lecture Series.”  In this series, they were to give a lecture to those attending as if it were their last.  The goal was to have the teachers give information to their students that they always wanted to say, but were too afraid of the consequences to utter.</p>
<p>In his book, <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Naked-Before-God-Return-Disciple/dp/0819218782/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&#038;s=books&#038;qid=1275684048&#038;sr=8-2"><strong><em>Naked Before God: The Return of the Broken Disciple</em></strong></a>, Bill Williams give his equivalent of “the last lecture.”  Williams, a CF patient, died soon after the book was published in 1988.  In the book, he merges past and present as his counterpart—Nathaniel the disciple, also dying of CF—interacts with Jesus and the other apostles.  Since neither Nathaniel nor Williams has much to lose, they ask the hard questions and make the even harder observations.</p>
<p>One of them was something that has also bothered me for quiet some time: <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 20-21" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2020-21/">Rev. 20-21</a>, the relationship between the Millennium and the New Jerusalem that come after.  As Williams notes (pgs 57-8), if the New Jerusalem represents Heaven or Eternity, why is there healing still going on?</p>
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<blockquote><p>Then he showed me the sparkling river of the water of life, clear as crystal.  It flowed from the throne of God and Lamb, down the middle of the great street of the city.  On either side stood a tree of life, yielding twelve crops of fruit, one for each month of the year; and the leaves of the trees are for the healing of the nations. (<em><a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 22:1-2" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2022.1-2/">Revelation 22:1-2</a>)</p>
<p>[jesus speaking to Nathaniel] “Now I ask you: what are the leaves for, if the nations that can reach them are already healed?”</em></p></blockquote>
<p>When you combine that question with issues dealing with the Millennium and the whole eschatological edifice falls to pieces.  In short, if the New Jerusalem is heaven, as it commonly interpreted, or after the resurrection from the dead and the judgment, then who is left to be healed? In all of the more popular interpretations, once the New Jerusalem is in place, all the bad guys are in the lake of fire and all the saints are in translated and glorified bodies.</p>
<p>This assertion is true for classic Premillennialism, Dispensationalism, Amillennialism, and even Postmillenialism.  All of these theories assume that <a class="bibleref" title="Rev. 21-22" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev.%2021-22/">Rev. 21-22</a> represents a future event, a time when Heaven and Earth merge together and God has put everything, as N. T. Wright states, to rights.  They may disagree on the nature of the Millennium (<a class="bibleref" title="Rev 20:1-7" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Rev%2020.1-7/">Rev 20:1-7</a>), but all of the positions agree that after the Millennium comes the Judgment and then eternity.</p>
<p>Williams question blasts that assumption to bits. In the process, he blasts all four Millennial positions to bits as well. If there are people who need healing, then whatever the time of the New Jerusalem is, it is not Heaven and it is not Eternity.  At least it cannot be Heaven or Eternity as writers in those positions use the terms.. </p>
<p>Even a bigger issue is the recipients of the healing leaves from New Jerusalem.  Just who are the “nations” or “ethnic groups” for whom the leaves are produced?  Not those in Hell, unless you believe in redemption from Hell after death (any takers?).  Certainly not those in Heaven, who are &#8220;healed&#8221; by definition already. </p>
<p>And if the New Jerusalem is not eternity or heaven, then just what is the millennium in Revelation? Only in the idealist/preterist viewpoint does this verse begin to make sense, in as much as those two schemes do not make Revelation future but implemented at the A.D. 70 destruction of Jerusalem.</p>
<p>But even that august Eschatology has issues.  As I noted in <a href="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/02/review-reading-the-bible-through-new-covenant-eyes-by-alan-bondar/">my last post</a>, the Preterists assume that the second coming happened in A.D. 70 with the destruction of Jerusalem and we are now in the eternal messianic kingdom.  </p>
<p>So where does the 1,000 year reign of Christ fit in?  After all, a chronological reading of Revelation has the Millenium happening AFTER the destruction of Jerusalem/Babylon depicted in chapter 19.   Yet the millennium is not an eternal age, lasting 1,000 years with an explicit terminus of Satan&#8217;s destruction in the Lake of Fire.  Yet many if not most Preterists claim this even <b>also</b> happened at A.D. 70.</p>
<p>So what is this millennium of which John speaks.  The Preterists claim chapter 20 is a re-capitulation of the previous chapters, in <a href="http://www.preteristcosmos.com/question5.html#note89">essence being identical with the period after Christ&#8217;s resurrection to just before the Jewish War of A.D. 67-70.</a>  Alan Bondar&#8217;s book, <strong><em><a href="http://www.publishamerica.net/product90410.html">Reading the Bible Through New Testament Eyes</a></em></strong>, makes much the same assertion.</p>
<p>So the 1,000 year Millenium lasts less than 37 years.   And if you read them carefully, the years A.D. 30 to 67/70 are also referenced as &#8220;the Last Days.&#8221;  So in this position, 1,000 years and Last Days are symbols that reference an identical period of time.  Now I agree symbols are flexible, but I think this identify stretches beyond my person endurance.  One obviously gives the impression of a short period of time (last days) and the other a period somewhat longer (1,000 years).  </p>
<p>At least a more honest Preterist is the author of the website <a href="http://prophecyhistory.com/">Prophecyhistory.com>/a>. He places the millennium as the actual 1,000 year period after the destruction of Jerusalem. The problem is that nothing of real significance happened in A.D. 1070. The author sites the occupation of Jerusalem by the Seljuk Turks.  Frankly I don&#8217;t think that was so earth shattering as the Lord&#8217;s pre-occupation with Jerusalem was over in A.D. 70.   Also, the author agrees, as he does not see Satan&#8217;s destruction until the start of the Protestant Reformation.  So Satan&#8217;s &#8220;short&#8221; release was a period of time almost half as long as the Millenium (1070-around 1517).  Again, this assertion stretches the language a bit, even for symbolism.</p>
<p>Curiously, the Catholic Preterist, Maurice Williams, in </a><a href="http://www.amazon.com/REVELATION-FALL-JUDEA-RISE-CHURCH/dp/0595484298/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&#038;s=books&#038;qid=1275686184&#038;sr=8-1"><strong><em>Revelation: Fall of Judea, Rise of the Church</em></strong></a> makes the millennium  date from the fall of Rome to the Start of the Reformation.  In his view, Satan&#8217;s release was the cause of the Reformation and not his destruction.  </p>
<p>So I guess it depends on which side of the Protestant/Catholic fence you sit that determines the nature of the millennium and its dating. Not the best example of exegesis, I would think.</p>
<p>I would prefer to get my exegesis from within the text of the Scriptures themselves.  Here I think the Book of Revelation will give us a better key.  After all, John expected his audience to be wise, but he did expect them to understand.   If <i>they</i> can, with some work, we should as well.  </p>
<p>And it should be a result that satisfies both a Millennial rule of Christ, the underlying meaning/impression built into the symbolic language, and the situation where nations remain healed by leaves from the New Jerusalem.  Perhaps if I can find such an integration, Bill Williams&#8217; last questions will not have been in vain.</p>
<p>Stay Tuned.</p>
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		<title>Joshua&#8217;s People 6/4/10</title>
		<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/04/joshuas-people-6410/</link>
		<comments>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/04/joshuas-people-6410/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jun 2010 02:05:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Caine</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Joshua's People]]></category>

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		<title>Review: Reading the Bible Through New Covenant Eyes by Alan Bondar</title>
		<link>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/02/review-reading-the-bible-through-new-covenant-eyes-by-alan-bondar/</link>
		<comments>http://www.wanderingheretic.com/2010/06/02/review-reading-the-bible-through-new-covenant-eyes-by-alan-bondar/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jun 2010 00:17:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Caine</dc:creator>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wanderingheretic.com/?p=657</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Alan Bondar&#8217;s first book is a good primer volume that presents the full Preterist interpretation of New Testament prophecy. For those not familiar with the position, it asserts that all of the prophecies of the New Testament (and a good portion of those in the Old) were fulfilled in the first century (preterist, basically being [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="padding: 10px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 18pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; float: left; font-family: times,serif; color: brown;"><img src="http://www.wanderingheretic.com/wp-images/newcovenanteyes.jpg" alt="Reading the Bible Through New Covenant Eyes" /></span>Alan Bondar&#8217;s first book is a good primer volume that presents the full Preterist interpretation of New Testament prophecy. For those not familiar with the position, it asserts that all of the prophecies of the New Testament (and a good portion of those in the Old) were fulfilled in the first century (preterist, basically being the Latin term for &#8220;past&#8221;).  For the full preterist, these prophecies include what is commonly called the Second Coming of Christ, which they claim was fulfilled &#8220;invisibly&#8221; or &#8220;symbolically&#8221; in the destruction of the Second Jewish Temple in A.D. 70.  For them, there is no more &#8220;second coming&#8221; in our future.  We are in the full Messianic Era, the New Heavens and Earth, now!</p>
<p>Bondar did not come to this position easily.  In fact, according to his acknowledgements, he was converted to this position during the course of writing this book.  </p>
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<blockquote><p>The first three chapters of this book were the contents of that original, incomplete manuscript.  My intention was to help people learn to read the Bible in context.  I had a totally different direction in mind for the rest of the book.  But as I began to put my own words into practice, I realized that my intended conclusions for the rest of the book were not being drawn from my prescribed method of reading the Bible</p></blockquote>
<p>That change in direction is the strength and weakness of the book.  As a strength, it has helped in create a good and fairly non-technical introduction to the arguments in favor of this Eschatology.  But the weakness remains that these first three chapters need some expansion, as I think they are critical to Bondar&#8217;s position.  It appears that Bondar rushed past them to get to the &#8220;good stuff&#8221; of presenting and defending Full Preterism.  For the record, these three propositions  are:</p>
<p>•	The Bible was written to a particular audience<br />
•	The Bible was written in a particular time<br />
•	The Bible was written for our joy</p>
<p>I agree wholeheartedly with these three statements.  But they are not drawn out nearly as much as I think they should be.  If they are the base of his methodology, then they deserve more than the few pages they are given.  For example, since, as Bondar claims—and I agree—most readers assume that he Bible was written directly to them, some of the techniques for breaking this engrained mental pattern should be presented.  Accordingly, it is imperative when reading Paul to identify to whom his pronouns apply.  Sometimes &#8220;we&#8221; may be the Apostles, sometimes it is Paul and his companions, sometimes it is the Jews, sometimes it is the entire church.  If we assume &#8220;we&#8221; (pun intended) is always all Christians at all times, a misunderstanding of Paul is going to be the inevitable result.  Indeed, Bondar uses this process in pages 213-218 when discussing <a class="bibleref" title="2 Corinthians 3" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/2%20Corinthians%203/">2 Corinthians 3</a> and 4.  But it comes out of the blue.  Though perhaps natural to Bondar, this methodology should have been explained in the first chapter.  After all, it helps define exactly who is &#8220;the particular audience.&#8221;</p>
<p>Second, though the methodology of Bondar&#8217;s three statements led him to full Preterism, it is not clearly explained  <i>how</i>!  I think a new section transitioning to his defense of full Preterism is in order.  I assume the time references to all the prophecies (soon, about to come, etc.) when combined with recognizing the first century audience receiving these words <i>was a first century audience</i> would make Bondar&#8217;s case.  Indeed, Alan may even say this is obvious.  I would say, to the audience intended for this book—those not familiar with the position—this transition needs better clarification.  I would put such a defense between the first three chapters and Bondar&#8217;s later expounding of Full Preterism.  In short, take the reader by the hand and help him learn the basic strokes before pushing them headfirst into the Preterist pool.</p>
<p>All that said, I think Bondar&#8217;s book fills a much need gap for those who wish to discuss full Preterism, or at least explore the position.  It is, as I said, a good introduction to the position that still gives some pretty weighty exposition and exegesis of the Scriptures should the reader wish to go deeper.  Certainly it is much more &#8220;newbie&#8221; friendly than, say the works of Don Preston and some others in the Preterist camp.  </p>
<p>In terms of its convincing ability, I cannot say as I am pretty much a full Preterist myself.  My only hesitations are the more common Preterist interpretations of the Millenium of <a class="bibleref" title="Revelation 20" href="http://www.esvbible.org/search/Revelation%2020/">Revelation 20</a>, their assertion that the New Covenant Age—and therefore the planet Earth—will last for eternity, and some measure of Gnostic rejection of the value of the physical creation over the a spiritualized existence in heaven.  Nor are these explicit requirements of this eschatology, as Sam Frost—another full preterist—has noted them himself.</p>
<p>Overall, with these few criticisms aside, this is an excellent book.  Its defense appears cogent and complete.  Also, Bondar writes without the rancor one often finds in this camp against &#8220;the futurists.&#8221;  He is a gracious as well as a persuasive writer.  Those looking to investigate Full Preterism could not find a better introductory volume.  It is readable and enjoyable.  I look forward to his next book.</p>
<p><strong><em>Reading the Bible Through New Covenant Eyes</em></strong> can be ordered <a href="http://www.publishamerica.net/product90410.html">here</a>.  Note that the price varies as sometimes the publisher offers deals without notice.  Also be aware that the book may take some time to be shipped—almost six weeks in my case—as it appears the publisher does a printing based on demand rather than doing a full run up front. </p>
<p>However, it is worth the wait.  Well worth the wait.</p>
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